Cadillac Man, here's a correction on one item regarding Bill Clinton and the national debt since there was the premise he paid it down but he absolutely did not.
WIKI: National debt of the United States
Survey
The chart shows gentle increases in the national debt up until Reagan from 1980-1988 when it zoomed from his military spending but which wasn't much of a surprise after he cut the tax rate twice.
However, Clinton from 1992-2000 didn't make it better in any tiny way since the national debt rose faster during his administration than it had done during that of Reagan. The neoliberal hucksterism in this one was presenting the reduction of the national deficit spending but that in no way resulted in a drop in the national debt since they were overspending already.
The chart also shows from 2000-2008 with George Bush when the national debt significantly rose again and we see from 2008-present under Barack Obama in which the national debt climbs like it's assisted by rockets.
Conclusion
Neoliberals / Centrists have been perpetrating a monstrous hoax and that's compounded by the fact Bill Clinton also murdered Glass-Steagall to usher in the era of the banks too big too fail. What do you know, eight years later after gobs of George Bush spending, they failed. Austerity programs have been the consequence around the world ever since.
The big banks own a significant chunk of the national debt and they will take more faster than a volcano eats virgins because that federal note means the bank is on the gravy train for life since they keep collecting interest and the principal will never be paid.
The coolness in talking to Cadillac Man is we can talk about such things without feeling some driving need to break out the pitchforks. It's also like that with Zen Yogi but his interests are not quite the same.
Zen Yogi: Booboo made a likeness of Donald Trump out of Velveeta cheese
Is it actually a good likeness?
Zen Yogi: sometimes a good likeness is the same as a bad likeness and that's how Alec Baldwin can play him
What will Booboo do with a Velveeta statue of Donald Trump?
Zen Yogi: he will eat it of course. Eat the rich!
That's deep, Yogi ... really heavy. I thought you didn't eat humans?
Zen Yogi: there is no transubstantiation in this story, Silas. Sometimes a Velvetta cheese statue of a heavy-handed, mealy-mouthed moron is exactly what it seems to be.
I see. So do you want to grill some cheeseburgers?
Zen Yogi: now you grok the Zen of it, Silas
WIKI: National debt of the United States
Survey
The chart shows gentle increases in the national debt up until Reagan from 1980-1988 when it zoomed from his military spending but which wasn't much of a surprise after he cut the tax rate twice.
However, Clinton from 1992-2000 didn't make it better in any tiny way since the national debt rose faster during his administration than it had done during that of Reagan. The neoliberal hucksterism in this one was presenting the reduction of the national deficit spending but that in no way resulted in a drop in the national debt since they were overspending already.
The chart also shows from 2000-2008 with George Bush when the national debt significantly rose again and we see from 2008-present under Barack Obama in which the national debt climbs like it's assisted by rockets.
Conclusion
Neoliberals / Centrists have been perpetrating a monstrous hoax and that's compounded by the fact Bill Clinton also murdered Glass-Steagall to usher in the era of the banks too big too fail. What do you know, eight years later after gobs of George Bush spending, they failed. Austerity programs have been the consequence around the world ever since.
The big banks own a significant chunk of the national debt and they will take more faster than a volcano eats virgins because that federal note means the bank is on the gravy train for life since they keep collecting interest and the principal will never be paid.
The coolness in talking to Cadillac Man is we can talk about such things without feeling some driving need to break out the pitchforks. It's also like that with Zen Yogi but his interests are not quite the same.
Zen Yogi: Booboo made a likeness of Donald Trump out of Velveeta cheese
Is it actually a good likeness?
Zen Yogi: sometimes a good likeness is the same as a bad likeness and that's how Alec Baldwin can play him
What will Booboo do with a Velveeta statue of Donald Trump?
Zen Yogi: he will eat it of course. Eat the rich!
That's deep, Yogi ... really heavy. I thought you didn't eat humans?
Zen Yogi: there is no transubstantiation in this story, Silas. Sometimes a Velvetta cheese statue of a heavy-handed, mealy-mouthed moron is exactly what it seems to be.
I see. So do you want to grill some cheeseburgers?
Zen Yogi: now you grok the Zen of it, Silas
20 comments:
Thanks Silas. One of those things I knew for sure that just wasn't so. UH!
I don't know where this chart came from or the details of the conversation. Clinton was the last president to run a budget surplus. And I believe that ran into the following year after he left office. While I have very little positive comments for Clinton considering the stains that he left on the Oval Office. He was somewhat fiscally responsible.
Bringing down deficit spending when the budget already blows through the previous year's level isn't fiscal responsibility but fast dancing with numbers for a P.R. show. As the chart shows, there hasn't been any fiscal responsibility in Washington since before 1980.
If it doesn't bring down the debt, it doesn't mean anything and he didn't. He also killed Glass Steagall so fiscal responsibility and Clinton just won't wash.
CM, I didn't say anything at the time but I was sure Clinton did nothing about the national debt so that meant a visit to Google.
That chart is a substantial part of why I paint them all the same. The give lots of speeches but that trend doesn't change so the speeches appear to be irrelevant.
Your chart only show total federal debt and from 1999 to 2001, the debt was flat to slightly reduced. Those were the last years of budget surplus. While billions do not make a significant bump on a chart with measurent of Trillions. That does not change the fact that those budgets were the last surplus budgets.
Yes, it does show only the national debt since I'm not at all interested in reviewing the national deficit which has never been more than a poker chip to amuse the crowd. The deficit changes each time they raise the debt ceiling. The key point is Clinton said he reduced the national debt and the chart clearly shows he did not but neither did any of the others although they blew gigantic volumes of smoke about it.
Your chart shows the dip in 2000. Since the graduations are at $200B. And the surplus was around $200B that dip is small. The impact of that surplus was minimal but it was there. It was followed by a return to deficit spending at record levels by both sides of the aisle
It slows slightly in 2000 but not much and not for long. I stopped believing there are two sides in Congress quite some time back. They give me no reason to believe it.
I have VERY little time for Clinton as he and his wife are probably the most corrupt politicians since Boss Tweed.
But he was the president to runbthe countrt at a profit. And if those who followed had continued his start, he would be remembered for something other than Bod.
Oh yeah we would be $14T less in debt
Check the numbers as he was just grandstanding and nothing significant happened with the national debt. Playing with the deficit only amuses the tourists who visit the White House that day. Congress plays that all day long and never reduces it. They have probably already raised the debt limit for Trump.
Wether or not he was grandstanding or not. Or if it was significant. Does not change the fact that thoss were surplus years.
Sorry that the numbers dont fit your statements but there was a surplus and the debt went down.
Pull actual data rather than this chart that has very little detail
I looked at the numbers again just now. The only change they make is to keep going up. Bumps along the way don't show as more than whimsy.
Your chart does not fit your statement.
You said Clinton did not make it bettsr in Any Tiny Way. Fact check says incorrect
The premise was that he paid it down. And your comment was Absolutely Not.
Fact check. Surplus for 1999. and even your chart show the dip.
But you refuse to agree with even tne data yiu supply
I find it amusing that I am defending Clinton's budgets
I'm looking at the chart and you're looking at anecdotes. There was no significant or lasting change to that trend anywhere in the forty years except it has increased vastly faster than the preceding years.
I don't know why you would defend his budget when you see what came after his administration. Why he and his evil woman are not in jail remains a mystery.
I am not defending his politics or the budget.
You contimue to state there was nit a surplus and there clearly was. And tbe national debt did go down You state that it did not.
Your vharts supports both statements. You contimue ti deny tbose events happened.
I am not defending his politics or the budget.
You contimue to state there was nit a surplus and there clearly was. And tbe national debt did go down You state that it did not.
Your charts supports both statements. You continue to deny those events happened.
They arent in jail as lawyers like Drs rarely go against thier own kind
You keep praising the wonderful country and that is tacit defense which amounts to the same thing
Please quote me on my undying support of any politician.
The closest I have come is to say I would give Trump a chance. Like the rest he failed miserably.
I do praise people in this country and do my brst to support them to step forward.
And again you side step you original assertion that Clintin absolutely did not reduce the debt when your chart clearly shows he did
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